Climate deniers rally while poll finds majority support carbon tax

Canberra was the focus of action today over climate change and the Government's proposed carbon tax, with an action for climate change petition presented, youth climate activists from AYCC in town to meet politicians, and the No Tax on Carbon rally attended by climate deniers and conservatives that had been actively promoted on shock-jock talk back radio as a "people's tax revolt".

People opposed to a carbon tax rallied at noon in Canberra, Melbourne and Brisbane. The protest in Canberra was organised by the Consumers and Taxpayers Assoc Inc. and 2GB broadcaster Chris Smith.

Organisers of the rally in Canberra said 3000 attended although police estimated about 1500. In Melbourne 100 people gathered outside the state Parliament according to the ABC, while 50 people gathered in King George Terrace in Brisbane.

If you go to the Consumers and Taxpayers website CO2 the truth page, they are strongly in the climate denial camp dismissing the huge amount of scientific research on climate change and CO2 emissions in favour of the arguments by climate denial websites.

Many reports in the press and twitter remarked on the predominance of baby boomers and retirees in the crowd at these protests, and their conservative makeup. At the Canberra protest a report in the Age said the "Young Liberals, DLP, Climate Skeptics, the National Civic Council and the Conservative Action Network" were all represented. One Nation was also there as well as Pauline Hanson who wandered the crowd being warmly received. The rally heard from Liberal Party leader Tony Abbott, Nationals Senator Fiona Nash and Angry Anderson amoung others. The protest has also been compared to the Tea Party protests in the USA.

From Twitter:
"@JamesScullin: A lot of racist placards unrelated to carbon tax at #noCTrally. Also Tea Party placards complete with American spelling!"

The Australian Youth Climate Coalition, representing 58,000 primarily young members, met with Prime Minister Julia Gillard and other politicians in Canberra. "Young people are the most important stakeholders when deciding climate change policy, as we will be the generation most affected by climate change," said Ellen Sandell, National Director of the AYCC.

Commenting on the No Carbon Tax rally Ellen Sandall said "We originally expected 5000 people to attend, bussed in from Sydney and Melbourne, but only 1000 have come out to Parliament House this afternoon" said Ms Sandell.

"After the rallies in Melbourne last weekend where over 8000 people joined together to call for a strong and immediate price on pollution, it is clear that the support within the community for action on climate change is broad and deep, particularly among young people" she said.

Read Mike Stuchbery's take on the rally at his blog article: The Ugly Australians or view Latika Bourke from the ABC on The anti carbon tax rally ... tweet by tweet.

The ACTU and WWF upstaged the rally with delivery of a 12,500 name petition calling for action on climate change to Greg Combet, the Climate Change and Energy Minister at a breakfast-time press conference.

"The people who have signed this petition are the silent majority of Australians who care about the nation's future and are not fooled by Tony Abbott's scare campaign," said ACTU President Ged Kearney.

Greg Combet said "the government has made it very clear that the revenue collected from the payment of the price on pollution by the large polluters in the economy will be used to help people, help households, particularly low and middle income households meet any price impacts. It will be used to support jobs in the most effected industries and it will be used to support other climate change programs in particular with an emphasis on support for clean energy technology."

Yesterday new telephone polling done by Galaxy Research for the Greens found that the majority of Australians want to tax polluters: 58% of Australians support "taxing the big polluters" , with only 17% supporting the coalition policy of "pay money to polluters to reduce their greenhouse gas emissions."




Seriously! What is a 'Climate Denier'? It's convenient short-hand for someone who knows that the theory behind CO2 forcing climate change has no proof - only numerical models and adjusted data - to support it.
People, there is no doomsday climate scenario that humans can ever control.
Good news, right? But not if you have something to gain from pricing carbon. Look around and see academics, oil companies and miners rubbing their hands in anticipation of a carbon price.
Ask around and find out what the naturaly concentrations of CO2 have been in our atmosphere, long before industrialisation. Ask around and find out that H20 (yes water vapour) accounts for 96% of the greenhouse effect. Tiny changes in humidity affect the Erarth's temperature. CO2 accounts for less than 4% of the greenhouse effect and, since industrialisation it's come up from say 350parts per million to about 385 parts per million - give or take a few ppm.
Has anyone told you that you exhale 4% CO2?
Has anyone pointed out that the puffy white coming from smokestaks is water vapour? The thin stacks that stand alone are the ones emitting CO2 and other contaminants. Do you feel mislead, or do you want to vilify me for writing this? Do you need a doomsday belief to fuel your passion?
Trillions of dollars are behind this 'green' movement, but my passion to protect the environment will not be hijacked, and why would anyone want to pay more for power? It's already gone up 40% since the great carbon hoohar, for goodness sake!
Peace to all of you, and save your hard earned $ and bleeding hearts for victims of real tragedies.

Read a scientific rebuttal of the factual distortions put forward by Gregg Thompson on CO2 at the Skeptical Science Preventing Misinformation Blog.

And in terms of money, most of it comes from the fossil fuel companies, Exxon Mobil, Koch Industries, in support of astroturf groups agitating to deny climate science and action on climate change.

The notable thing is the scientific consensus that 97% of climate scientists agree that the climate is changing and that we are causing it. The evidence is now so extensive that to deny this is equivalent to believing the world is flat. But I guess there are still flat earthers out there.

The worlds leading climate change body (IPCC) has admitted it was wrong about key predictions on global warming.
The UN's pannel of climate scientists,The Intergovernmental Pannel on Climate Change(IPCC) claimed that the Himalayan glaciers would vanish by 2035.
But the pannel chairman admitted that the figures were wrong.
Dr Hasnain has admitted his claim was just "speculation"rather than based on any scientific fact.The 2035 date was then used by the world wildlife fund in 2005 before appearing in the IPCC 2007 report.

Perched on the Karakoram mountains in the Himalays a group of some 230 Glaciers are growing.Among legendary peaks of Nt.Everest like K2 and Nanga Paribat,glaciers are growing and have been for almost three decades.
John Shroder of the university of Nabraska-Omaha said all of them are advancing.
When Shroder and a team of researchers examined satelite imagery of the regions glaciers dating back to the 1960's,they found 187 glaciers had serged foward and are growing in mass and have been since 1980.
So much for Dr Hasnain's "speculation" and the IPCC running with his "speculation" but why let facts get in the way of a good story?
What about the rest of the world and melting glaciers?Mt. Shasta's glacier are growing both the Hothlum and Whitney and Konwakiton glaciers have grownby a third.
Scientists first became aware of these growing California glaciers in 2002,and began writing about them in 2003 now eight years later Climate change advocates like Takver refuse to face facts.
Glaciers are also growing in Washington and Alaska.Glaciers on Glacier Peak in Washington state are growing.And Crater Glacier on Mt. Saint Helens is now larger than it was before yhe 1980 eruption.
Glaciers are growing in Alaska for the first time in 250 years. two years ago in May,Alaska's Hubbard Glacier was advancing at a rate of 2 metres per day n
more than half a mile a year.In Icy Bay at least three glaciers advanced 1/2 a KM in one year.
The Juneau ice fields which covers 3900 sq Km and is the 5th largest ice field in the Western hemisphere, is growing.
According to Michael Zemp at the university of Zurich one of the scientists that Al Gore likes to quote said the ice was growimg in the north Cascade Mountains and the Juneau ice fields.
Antarctic Ice, greater than 2.5metres thick
has doubled since 2008.Antarctic has 90% of the worlds ice.
I think it was scientists that said the world was flat.
I don't mean to be a Holocaust Denier whoops climate change denier or anti semitic Whoops anti climatic just telling it the way it is.
Takver sorry to bother you with such inconvenient facts
One last thing Takver do you have the guts to put your real name to the dribble you speak?

> has admitted it was wrong about key predictions on global warming.

Key prediction my ass

> but why let facts get in the way of a good story?

i don't know... why would you?

also if your going to bulk copy/pasta at least give us a source... or are we meant to think you where smart enough to write that?

The glaciers are growing thats a fact,so you have all been hiding this fact from us why?they photo's to prove it what have you got "speculation"? good on ya

Prof Fluffy Bunny your another one that use your real name are you worried when every one realizes global warming is lies you will look like the fool you are?

I read www realclimate what a load of crap it was climate gate that made the IPCC change it's mind on the 2035 date for the Himalaya's to vanish lie.

So fluffy bunny do you believe that Glaciers are growing or are you a glacier denier?

The whole global warming has been blown wide open Glaciers are not melting they are growing the world is getting colder not hotter and the sea level is not rising

You are all a pack of sheep that can't think for your selves(you should change your name to woolly sheep) give us some facts not speculation or hypothesis you and your lies a being found out LOL

> realclimate what a load of crap


> do you believe that Glaciers are growing or are you a glacier denier?

which glacier?

The statements are all wrong and from someone again who has absolutely no scientific knowledge and mixes up random facts which have nothing to do with the issue. For a start CO2 cannot be seen as its an invisible gas it cannot have the same effect as a cloud of visible water vapour in causing heat to be trapped by the sun. The issue is about the percentage contribution that other gases such as CO2 contribute in clear invisible air with all effects of daily fluctuations in water vapour not taken into account or relevant. The effect is added to the other greenhouse gasses causing effects. The CO2 effects are small but increasing over a very long period of many many years and which can be measured with great accuraccy which is why we know that the slowly increasing average YEARLY temperature and glogal warming which has and continues to be measured all over the globe and the climate studied by 20000 reputable scientists the world over have agreed on the facts of this. You dont believe them? What 1 non scientist against 20000?? The other comments are likewise completely irrelevant to the issue of increasing CO2 and global warming. The issue about power price increases has far more to do with the fact that the governments everywhere sold off all the power assets to companies who BORROWED the money to buy them and so you are now paying their increasing interest bills for them. Then there is the global price of coal pushed up by other Countries needs and supply and demand markets just like oil. The interest payment is subject to the banks whims and international currency movements. These changes have far greater effect of increasing the price of electricity than any carbon tax can ever impose. Get your facts right.

Is this supposed to be journalism in any way shape or form?

What an appalling piece of subjective garbage.

I know of nobody who denies climate change. I have yet to meet a flesh and blood denier. There are plenty of us who insist on better evidence, reliable data, and less hype. Ecotards.

What kind evidence do you require? Have you even read the scientific literature? Or do you base your opinion on the popular media hype?

Please show where the scientific journals are lacking adequate peer review.

Please link us to scientific papers showing that current climate theory has shown to be wrong.

And 'climategate' doesn't count. That whole thing certainly does not disprove current climate change theory. That was part of the hype.

Climate proves the scientists are full of shit sea levels have not risen in 5 years ice in the south pole has stopped melting the tempature of the planet risen by 0.6 degrees C in the last century but it dropped by 0.6 of a degree in 2007 one year in melbourne it is fucking cold our rain fall is back to normal not a extreme condition in the next few years you will see things back to what we are use to and nobody has cut carbon dioxide yet so much for global warming.

your right nobody denies climate change, it has been changing since the beginning of time like medieval times it was very hot then cooled down what I dont believe in is Man made climate change.
We see where the climate change conspirators have deleted hot periods in time to suit their conspiracy theories on climate change yes they were caught red handed!
All climate change scientists openly admit it is a hypothesis for those of you who dont know what that means it is a supposition or guess put forward to account for certain facts and used as a basis for further investigation by which it may be proved or disproved in other words a stab in the dark.

So now we will get a carbon tax which will raise petrol by six cents a litre it already fluctuates by fifteen cents a litre but I dont see any decline in vehicles on the road so I cant see that changing anyones driving I know it wont stop me.Electricity is set to rise by three hundred dollars a year that means a extra five dollars eighty a week big deal that wont make me turn off the light in the dunny or change my electricity use.

I don't get it hows a carbon tax going to change anything it's just a another Government grab for money.

Just because I dont believe that a new tax on just about everything isnt going to make any change in emissions doesn't make me a denier does it.
I believe in political truthfulness and integrity. Obviously Im niave but Ms Gillard did say no carbon tax under a government that she leads.
If the policy is good whats the rush to introduce it by July next year?
What happened to the consultation. Why not another summit and then a referendum.
A tax is nothing to do with climate change and everything to do with Revenue.

Actually setting a carbon price is all to do with business certainty. The power industry and other major secondary industries need to know the approximate tax and regulatory environments for major investment decisions for 5-10 years down the track.

What we see now, in the electricity industry particularly, are decisions being made in the short term, such as building gas fired generation plants or holding off on infrastructure decisions, which is resulting in increasing electricity prices.

Once a carbon pricing regime is set for the long term, business can invest for the long term in low pollution technology.

Circumstances change. Gillard did say no carbon tax but also affirmed the Labor policy to introduce an emissions trading scheme prior to the election. Gillard was elected as a minority Government and needed to deal with the Greens and independants in the lower House, and the Greens with the balance of power in the Senate from July 1st. All parties were invited to be represented in the Multi-party climate change committee but the Liberal and National parties purposely chose to boycott that committee. The fixed carbon price leading to an ETS came out of this committee. Get over it!

A set carbon price (carbon tax) leading in to an emissions trading scheme is a fast and efficient mechanism to start setting a price on carbon pollution which will allow for the business certainty for future investment decisions.

We have had two elections now in which climate change has figured prominently, and that people want action from Government in regulating carbon pollution.

The opposition policy would see billions of dollars paid out from general revenue to subsidise polluters to reduce carbon emissions. Does that sound like sound climate pollution reduction policy to you?

It's reaching a little bit to say you're independent, isn't it? I've never seen a more lopsided opinion piece.

What a load of lies!
Get your facts right before you comment on what happened at the rally.
Everything that has been said over the past 2 days in the Main stream media have been lies including this desperate attempt at smearing everyday Aussies that want to stand up and say no to a carbon dioxide tax.
All you pro-climate change/global warming arlamists are running scared so now you have to resort to name calling and insultes. You know the end is near and your lies are being exposed for the world to see.
The climate change/global warming religion is comming to an end.
Did you see the poll on ninemsn?
It looks like the rest of Australia doesn't want a carbon tax. More than 80% said no to a carbon tax. And in this pathetic attempt of journalism you claim that most of Australia wants the tax. Another lie by the warmists. Lies and more lies. This is how low the warmists have become.
And you call yourself independent. Pathetic, get a new

Actually I did see that poll that was mentioned on ninemsn. The poll was undertaken on March 7 by essential media, about a 10 days after the announcement of the carbon tax. I don't where you get the figure of 80% from, thin air?

To the Q. Do you support or oppose the Government’s recent announcement to introduce a carbon pricing scheme from 1 July 2012, which will require industries to pay a tax based on the amount of carbon pollution they emit? 35% of respondents supported the proposal, 48% of respondents opposed the proposal.

To the Q. Do you think the Government needs to take action on climate change as soon as possible, should they wait a few years before taking action or don’t they need to take any action at all? - 47% said Need to take action as soon as possible; 24% said Can wait a few years before taking action; 19% said Don’t need to take any action; and 11% said Don't know

A fortnight later in the Galaxy poll 18-20 March in the Question: Thinking now about some federal issues. All sides of Australian politics agree that there is a need to reduce greenhouse gas emissions to help address climate change. Do you believe that the best way to achieve this is to tax the big polluters or pay money to polluters to reduce their greenhouse gas emissions? 58% said tax the big polluters and 17% said pay money to polluters.

Part of the issue here is the way you frame the question can partly determine a result. The polls were also separated by two weeks, done by separate companies under different methodologies, Two weeks can be a lifetime in politics.

But of course what we really require here is leadership by Gillard in implementing a carbon price, similar to John Howard in implementing the Gun buy-back scheme in 1996 that was directly subsidised by the taxpayers through an increase in the medicare taxation levy. I guess you complained about that too?

In Europe they have been living with a carbon emissions trading scheme for 6 years and the sky hasn't fallen. Time for Australia to catch up.


The price of petrol and electricity has gone through the roof in the last year has it stopped me using it?No! have I used less?No! so how will a carbon dioxide tax make me use less?Where does the money go? to the Government. If the government want to reduce carbon dioxide stop mining coal it's that fucking simple but then that would hurt their pocket they are full of shit but then again thats what you get when you get a woman to do a mans job.

QUOTE: "What a load of lies! Get your facts right before you comment on what happened at the rally.
Everything that has been said over the past 2 days in the Main stream media have been lies including this desperate attempt at smearing everyday Aussies that want to stand up and say no to a carbon dioxide tax.
All you pro-climate change/global warming arlamists are running scared so now you have to resort to name calling and insultes. You know the end is near and your lies are being exposed for the world to see.
The climate change/global warming religion is comming to an end.
Did you see the poll on ninemsn?
It looks like the rest of Australia doesn't want a carbon tax. More than 80% said no to a carbon tax. And in this pathetic attempt of journalism you claim that most of Australia wants the tax. Another lie by the warmists. Lies and more lies. This is how low the warmists have become.
And you call yourself independent. Pathetic, get a new job."

WARMISTS? Lols, ok forget climate change - are you really saying pollution is good? Please can we keep pollution to save a few bucks? Or... how about no, we get a carbon tax and start cleaning up shit one step at a time... do you not realise how much we have been fucking up the planet?

I think people like you are too dumb to have left the 'safe bubble' attutude we grow up in as children, believing all in the world is safe and good and bad things dont happen.


You are brainwashed and its easier to just believe there is no problem. And yes we are alarmed - because so many people like yourself are so fucking dumb to understand how the world works.

I dont need to be told about climate change, or pollution, or 'doomsday' this or that. I just look around for myself - ITS FUCKING OBVIOUS.

Heres something interesting to consider if trying to decide who to believe: Who is brainwashed/mislead, the people for or against reducing pollution?

A. AGAINST REDUCING POLLUTION: Who gains from not doing anything? The people who pollute, the big companies with dollars to gain/lose and to buy votes/advertising/opinions.

B. FOR REDUCING POLLUTION: We just want to save the fucking planet and the exisitance of the human race, that is the only gain - what big money is behind this? Fuck all. And its something so goddamn major thats why we're very motivated.


This is the big money brainwashers vs real people - we have to be alarmingly vocal.

FEAR? So many are being brainwashed into FEARING A FEW DOLLARAS IN OUR WALLET.
Why do more people seem scared of that than WHAT REALLY COUNTS - LIFE AND THE PLANET.



My question to those who think a carbon tax should be made...
Why are we bringing in a tax when Australia's yearly emissions is equally to the emissions China make in 9 days... Australia reducing their emissions would make nearly no impact on the environment... China would just need to be awake for 9 days for it to be worth nothing... We are not saving the world!!

2nd, the government is happy to sell millions of tonnes of coal (fossil fuels) to other countries which FYI are being burnt and causing emissions, this proves the government have no real interest in the environment, they are just wanting to make some money

I appreciate people dreaming big and living in a world were they think they can make a major difference by paying a few extra dollars when paying petrol, but living in reality you will see that your just paying more money and more people are in financial distress...


Just look at the data, the scientific evidence that human-induced climate change is occurring is overwhelming. The rest of the world (with a few exceptions, namely those also reliant on fossil fuel, like America) does not have trouble believing the data. Some of the comments are so embarrassing, they make Australians look like a bunch of yokels.

I earn very little. I am happy to cut costs elsewhere and pay a carbon tax. I make no apology for looking at the data myself and making up my own mind, rather than believing what I read.

Mr Anonymous - " earn very little. I am happy to cut costs elsewhere and pay a carbon tax. " I bet your on the dole budging on Australia. If Bob Brown the Bowel Bugler has his way we will all be sitting in a cave welcoming refugees in to squat with us.

This is the problem with Australia any other country you would starve to death and no-one would need to listen to you. Think of the tax savings!!

Now I would love to know what poll found majority support (Maybe a green party meeting?) I would love this to actually go to the polls and see the outcome. There is a reason the lying piece of crap wont go to the "polls" or hold a referendum because she already knows the outcome. Not meaning any of them ill will but the best thing for Australia now would be if one of them dies and a by-election is called.

Prime Minister Gillard won't go to a election on the Carbon Tax because she Knows the MAJORITY of Australians don't want it, so your head line Climate deniers rally while poll finds majority support carbon tax, is just bullshit and you know it.